alexander.bock at piratenpartei-bayern.de
Mon Jun 8 21:11:22 CEST 2009
As far as I'm concerned: You're more or less preaching to the choir.
Anyway, for now, I think getting another seat would be favorable to
Am 08.06.2009 um 21:01 schrieb Reinier Bakels:
>> > Didn't Ireland reject this disguised constitution?
>> It's a complicated matter, calling it a "disguised constitution"
>> really doesn't live up to that.
> I hate this debate about a "disguised constitution", becase it
> focuses on the wrong things.
> Is the question: "constitution yes/no?" No, it is not. Any by-law
> (written or unwritten) of a (supra-)national organisation is a kind
> of constitution.
> So what is the question then? It is whether the Lisbon treaty is
> better than the Nice treaty, in the right direction.
> What is "the right direction?" Populists argue: "less Europe". I
> would argue that the EU is an unavoidable reality, so one should
> concentrate on a proper policy maing process, includiing a proper
> division of tasks between memer states and the Union. But that is
> exacly an aspect of "Lisbon".
> Is a referendum indispensable? I don't think so. Referenda should be
> on basic yes/no questions. The Lisbon treaty is about the
> complicated question how to organise the EU in the future. For such
> questions, we invented *the representative democracy*. Professional
> politicians should articulate the issues.
> But isn't a referendum needed anyway because the Lisbon treaty is
> equivalent to a national constitution change? Well, that depends on
> whether national constitution changes require a referendum. In NL,
> the process to change the constitution is that twice an absolute
> majority is needed, with (general) elections in between, and the
> constitution explitly says that the same procedure (not less, not
> more) should be followed for constitution-like treaties.
> The European project is in crisis. Nationalism is the new fashion.
> The problem is exacerbated by the present economic crisis. "Our own
> people first" is the slogan of the neo-facists. Imho saving European
> solidarity is a priority. But admittedly a lot must be changed. Like
> the EU should get a truly European parliament, where people can
> directly vote politicians from other countries.
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
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