[pp.int.general] European citizens' Initiative - ID requirement & data retention

[Jerry Weyer]

Dear Pat,

On Sat, Jan 7, 2012 at 11:32 AM, Pat Mächler <
patrick.maechler at pp-international.net> wrote:

> Unfortunately the thing is a bit more complicated than you present it
> and I would all pirates urge to read this mail carefully, before go
> into action mode in a blind-folded mind.

The ECI - as it is currently regulated - could likely become either a
> stillbirth or even a tool that might be used against our ideals; as
> much as a "good implementation" of sth like the ECI on EU level would
> be in pressing need.
>

That's exactly why I ask people to check how their member states plans to
implement the ECI and act accordingly. Just because it "can" be doesn't
mean it has to!


> The problem starts by as EU member states hold the sole power to hand
> in these petitions and are free to implement the verification process
> to their willing; there is no safe-guard yet!
> e.g. in NL the ministry of economical affairs is doing the
> implementation and is going to ask some NGO (!) to arrange the
> verification process.
>

So lobby your government to chose appropriate partners. Why condemn the
whole process beforehand? Also there are other people that complain because
government agencies should verify signatures - they could influence the ECI
too!


> This is just a great tool for political abuse for foreign, national
> and/or corporate power-play interests, instead of interests of common
> European citizens.
> I'm not making this up; we've just seen that Spain has been subject to
> pressure by the US when it came to the Sinde law, as well as Sweden
> was once.
>

I don't see your point. How would that work exactly? The verification
agency would forge thousands of signatures?

I get that these initiatives can be influenced, and are. When Greepeace
collects over 1 Million signatures against GMOs, they used all their
political power to get them. I still don't see how you can compare that to
lobbyists and government influencing legislators on a diplomatic level.
Please explain how the US pressuring Spain to implement stronger copyright
law leads you to the ECI.


> So before advertising the ECI we should ensure that the verification
> process is indeed more due to integer verification and not just up to
> some random institution in a member state.
>
> Furthermore concerning the ID number usage:
> You see...one can criticize the use of the ID number, but you need
> some sort of verification if a citizen's initiative should be
> something more than just a random internet petition in order to proof
> that signatures are +/- legit, not something that was just setup for
> power-play interests; it does not need to be the ID number
> (Switzerland uses birth dates and the place of residence, besides the
> name), but there's hardly any use for an initiative where signatures
> can't be verified to a certain extent.
>

You say it yourself: Name and address are enough. In Luxembourg f.ex. you
could have access to medical records with the ID number they want you to
use to subscribe. People know that and will be more unlikely to subscribe.


> Please read the current EU regulations on the ECI and make them
> subject to careful dissection of what would be needed to prevent
> power-play abuse.
>

I did. Our national data protection agency shares my opinion:
http://www.europaforum.public.lu/fr/actualites/2012/01/initiative-citoyenne-piratepartei-cnpd/index.html
 (French).

I don't think ECI makes the EU perfectly democratic one day to the other.
But if there is the possibility to influence the Commission only slightly,
why not use it and make sure it's accessible?

Kind regards,

Jerry


>
> -pat
>
> On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 10:15 PM, Jerry Weyer
> <jerry.weyer at piratepartei.lu> wrote:
> > Dear Pirates,
> >
> > I'd like to make you aware of an important topic: the European citizens'
> > initiative (ECI). On April 1st 2011 the first ECIs can be deposited with
> the
> > EU Commission. If at least 1 Million citizens of more than 6 EU countries
> > sign an initiative the Commission has to take it into consideration.
> While
> > the initiative itself is not binding on the Commission is sends a strong
> > sign that EU citizens want a change in policy that cannon be ignored by
> the
> > Commission. At the very least the ECI will increase political discussions
> > cross-border EU wide, which is always a good thing. More info on the ICE
> > here: http://ec.europa.eu/dgs/secretariat_general/citizens_initiative/
> >
> > Why I write to you is because some countries plan to force ECI
> supporters to
> > provide an ID number when signing an initiative. The danger of requiring
> an
> > ID card number when signing a petition is that a lot of potential
> supporters
> > are scared off. Even more important is that it might limit the people who
> > can collect signatures as the collection and storage of ID card numbers
> > might be regulated by national data protection laws. Therefore I urge
> every
> > Pirate Party and interested person to lobby their governments to delete
> the
> > requirements of an ID number if that is still possible.
> >
> > Then I wanted to ask if any Pirate Party in the EU already planned an
> ECI or
> > supported a group that does. Imo an ECI to stop the data retention
> directive
> > has real chances to succeed and Pirates could play an important role in
> > collecting signatures. If you plan anything in this direction please let
> me
> > know as I'm currently contacting NGOs on this topic to work on an ECI.
> >
> > Kind regards,
> >
> > Jerry
> >
> >
> > ____________________________________________________
> > Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> > pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> > http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
> >
> ____________________________________________________
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>



-- 

Piratepartei Lëtzebuerg
1, Sonnestrooss
5683 Dalheim
Luxembourg

http://www.piratepartei.lu
jerry.weyer at piratepartei.lu
+352 661 86 04 01
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