[pp.int.general] a few problems with this list and lack of responsibility from PPI

[Nuno Cardoso]

On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 6:14 PM, Josef Ohlsson Collentine <
international at piratpartiet.se> wrote:

> Thanks for in-directly pointing out several problems with the current way
> things are run.
>

Always glad to help, and I felt that the confusion needed to be addressed,
because if members are ignoring their membership and PPI because of a
non-PPI list then that needs to be clarified and sorted out.


> As you mention the only lists PPI supports are the official ones. They
> only have lists for leaders, leaving no place for normal members to discuss.
>

Well, actually I think the "leaders" designation is poorly chosen, some
PP's don't even have "leaders", those lists should be the lists for the
official representatives/delegates (which can of course also be the leaders
in their own PP, but it's not PPI's job to say so).
Anyway, the normal members of PPI are institutions, PPI has no individual
members, so I guess you are referring to the general discussion between
members of members.
In that case I agree there appears not to be any official list in PPI for
that yet, and since at least one PPI member seems to be neglecting PPI
because of the lack of moderation on this other non-PPI list, maybe it
would be a good idea to start an official parallel moderated list for
everyone with clear moderation rules set by the all members, because we
need them all to be comfortable enough with it to participate. I'll bring
this up at the next meeting.


> If PPI would be strictly beurocratic it would make sense to have it that
> way but they are trying to reach all ways with their goals. Claiming to be
> transparent and democratic
>

I think PPI will remain true to it's transparent and democratic goals if it
set's up a parallel moderated list with transparent rules chosen
democratically by it's members.


> If PPI has no wish to be affiliated in any way with this list then at
> least try to make an attempt of changing it's name.
>

>From that email it appears that at least one member doesn't want to (and
more from other emails I've read), maybe we should poll the members on the
issue, as PPI is the members and if a majority doesn't want affiliation we
should attempt that.


> Or at the very least give an option to those persons that want to discuss
> relevant things in a relevant place.
>
If this is not the place then where?
>

Exactly! I have a feeling that may be fixed soon :)


> This list has clearly said it will enforce no rules and leave discussion
> climate free to any troll who wishes to speak, thus it's not an option for
> me to try to have a serious conversation with people. It  brings more
> head-ache then good with constant bickering and personal attacks.
>

I totally agree :)


> One of big flaws of PPI today is that it's not democratic enough imo. "PPI
> is it's members" <- members here signify "board members of respective
> parties in PPI" whom almost all have too much focus on national affairs to
> spend that effort dividing their time to a beurocratic international
> organization that clearly needs a lot of work to improve. If you're just a
> normal member of a party but interested in international affairs you don't
> have much of a say in PPI. This exclusive climate is hurting more than it's
> aiding.
>

PPI can only succeed in being as democratic for the individual members of
it's PP members as it's PP members are for them. If a PP member is
organized in such a way as to concentrate all responsibilities in some few
individuals of a board and doesn't allow for delegation of responsibilities
to those who have time and are interested in contributing then it's that PP
member who is doing a really bad job at being part of an organization that
it has no time for because of it's national affairs and poor organization
of willing resources to represent itself.


> Kindly,
> Josef
> (strictly my own opinions and do not represent PPSE)
>

Pirate regards,
Nuno
(also strictly my own opinions and do not represent any institution)
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