<html>
<head>
<style><!--
.hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;
padding:0px
}
body.hmmessage
{
font-size: 10pt;
font-family:Tahoma
}
--></style>
</head>
<body class='hmmessage'>
> Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 23:16:24 -0500<br>> From: ktetch@gmail.com<br>> To: pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Love and Solidarity to our Tunisian Brothers and Sisters<br>> <br>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----<br>> Hash: SHA1<br>> <br>> On 1/14/2011 10:45 PM, Rodrigo dA wrote:<br>> > Andrew, nice memory you have :)<br>> <br>> I've read the mars series at least once a year since 97. in 98 it was a<br>> toss-up between going to the first Battlebots, or the first Mars Society<br>> convention in Colorado (their plans were using the mars books as a<br>> basis), as Mars colonisation was my original plan (first degree<br>> robotics, second astrophysics) So I know the books backwards. And I was<br>> at a special event when Antartica came out, due to my links with the<br>> BSSF back then<br>> <br>> > Jack, you're right, it doesn't imply it, i wasn't going for that, i was<br>> > just questioning<br>> > the value of being serious. Why do we have to play the good old<br>> > politician to make<br>> > changes?<br>> <br>> Well, you can use the UK as an example. The Monster Raving Looney party<br>> tried the whole 'social revolution' tack, it didn't work. Ok some of<br>> their 'loony' policies got enacted 10-15 years later (like compulsory<br>> seat belt wearing) but not because of the parties, because of the<br>> advance of science.<br>> <br>> You have to use what's there, the levers that the system has in place.<br>> You could take those levers and arrange flowers, or hit people over the<br>> head with them sure, but it won't get the job done in the end. We may<br>> have to modify the levers (make them longer) or move them about a bit,<br>> but unless we use them, we'll just be wasting our time and energy.<br><br>This is the main point, what's there, we have to use it to our advantage,<br>but not be constrained by it. I'm currently reading Foucault and in <br>Microphysics of power he discusses about how "what's there" is <br>already narrowing our view of what could be there. (or at least this is how i <br>interpreted it)<br><br>Now, i may go, it's friday and i'm neglecting my psychoactives :P<br><br>> <br>> > I think the pirate movement is bigger than politics, is somewhat of a<br>> > cultural revolution.<br>> > <br>> Right, it's about information distribution, a bit like Audi's Vorsprung<br>> durch Technik ethos. Mass information manipulation and distribution,<br>> which wasn't available in the past. In the mid-80s, it would take me<br>> almost 5 minutes to load in a word processor into my computer, then<br>> another minute to load in the document by tape. By disc it was quicker,<br>> but still hard to work on things, no copy and paste or alt+tab-ing.<br>> Compare that to right now, when I have 7 text documents open, 150 tabs<br>> (god bless Opera, try THAT on friedfox) half a dosen IM windows, my<br>> email client and 25 different IRC channels (and #PPI is looking quite<br>> sparse these days) Even the mid 90s, I would hesitate breaking out<br>> Deluxe Paint 3 to create a diagram, because it was complex and annoying<br>> - - I can crate a diagram these days in less than an hour now (such as a<br>> flowchart on lucidchart, like the one here<br>> http://ktetch.blogspot.com/2011/01/where-torrents-infringe.html)<br>> <br>> The kind of cultural revolution Jay seems to be going for (and this is<br>> from a year of having to deal with him) has already been and gone. It<br>> was the Punk/anarchist movement in the 80s. Sometimes, I even wonder if<br>> he's acting out a caricature of Rick from The Young Ones<br>> (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Young_Ones_(TV_series)#Rick) The past<br>> is the past, let's work to the future.<br>> <br>> Andrew<br>> <br>> > -rodrigo<br>> >> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 03:29:05 +0000<br>> >> From: m2ys4u@gmail.com<br>> >> To: pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Love and Solidarity to our Tunisian<br>> > Brothers and Sisters<br>> >><br>> >> That's somewhat of a false dichotomy. Being serious does not imply<br>> >> stealing, violating human rights and ignoring those whom we represent.<br>> >><br>> >> Having not read any Kim Stanley Robinson novels, I can't really comment<br>> >> on that, but decentralisation also does not imply anarchy.<br>> >><br>> >> --<br>> >> Jack Allnutt (PPUK)<br>> >><br>> >> On 15/01/2011 03:07, Rodrigo dA wrote:<br>> >> > Nay, old parties were serious, top-down, hierarchical movements, and<br>> >> > their seriousness<br>> >> > didn't prevent them from stealing, violating human rights and ignoring<br>> >> > the people they<br>> >> > were supposed to represent.<br>> >> > The way i get pirate movements is playful, horizontal and decentralized.<br>> >> > Like in those<br>> >> > Kim Stanley Robinson novels.<br>> >> ><br>> >> > -rodrigo<br>> >> >> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2011 03:03:03 +0000<br>> >> >> From: m2ys4u@gmail.com<br>> >> >> To: pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Love and Solidarity to our Tunisian<br>> >> > Brothers and Sisters<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> I sincerely hope not.<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> Pirates are not "the youth gone wild". We're supposed to be a serious<br>> >> >> political movement not a bunch of anarchistic teenagers sitting at<br>> > their<br>> >> >> computers raging at the grown-up world.<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> We're going to get nowhere if that's your frame of mind and/or the<br>> > image<br>> >> >> you put across.<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> --<br>> >> >> Jack Allnutt (PPUK)<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> On 15/01/2011 02:52, Kenneth Peiruza wrote:<br>> >> >> > I like it!<br>> >> >> ><br>> >> >> > Can be reproduce your text? :D If so, this can be a good starting<br>> > point<br>> >> >> > for a joint-PP's-PR we will produce for next monday.<br>> >> >> ><br>> >> >> ><br>> >> >> ><br>> >> >> > On 15/01/11 03:36, Rodrigo dA wrote:<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> +1<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2011 21:34:51 -0500<br>> >> >> >> From: jemers2@gmail.com<br>> >> >> >> To: pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> >> Subject: [pp.int.general] Love and Solidarity to our Tunisian<br>> >> > Brothers and Sisters<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> Pirates and non-pirates alike, we are the youth gone wild. May all<br>> >> > tyrants of the world who rule with an iron fist rusting on their thrones<br>> >> > take notice. Your end is near.<br>> >> >> >> Jay Emerson<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> Administrative Officer<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> Pirate Party of New York<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________<br>> >> >> >> Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> >> >> pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> >> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >><br>> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________<br>> >> >> >> Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> >> >> pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> >> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> >> >> ><br>> >> >> > ____________________________________________________<br>> >> >> > Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> >> > pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> > http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> >> >><br>> >> >> ____________________________________________________<br>> >> >> Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> >> pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> >> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> >> ><br>> >> ><br>> >> ><br>> >> > ____________________________________________________<br>> >> > Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> > pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> > http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> >><br>> >> ____________________________________________________<br>> >> Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> >> pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> >> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> > <br>> > <br>> > <br>> > ____________________________________________________<br>> > Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> > pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> > http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br>> <br>> <br>> - -- <br>> Andrew Norton<br>> http://ktetch.blogspot.com<br>> Tel: (352)6-KTETCH [352-658-3824]<br>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----<br>> Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (MingW32)<br>> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/<br>> <br>> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJNMR+YAAoJECjjuYTW3X5HoK4IAMbMRNfy0j2jVQ/F1OhsPfxY<br>> CyAsXOBcpKIFc2hjhWhbr4EwxQR4hY6vKKCpfWVQqmIAYET2E/ba+ERYzS4anG9n<br>> gQpH/4LTRhKyXMDCK9QeuTSradCMYNXUiEKcnUEaIuFunQ853iaj90kf8+3nAomm<br>> i03P1mdffMBK4R9HRlBP7erNb/UvFDguX5+qRY7b5yIVmpqUAYdYxfJNM/GnErGI<br>> txqj+MiTrPzLRT6049CicJPH+KYGjdbkrSryAUdG3buT+MepKNsCd4nfbsTTMnbv<br>> sO1e0sEJ6kvM/qoRH3RbQ9StD7x4jbAcrL2Avy3xqSrrppXonjwVtcNtgSp5ib0=<br>> =6hhM<br>> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----<br>> ____________________________________________________<br>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk<br>> pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general<br> </body>
</html>