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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 24.09.2012 21:30, schrieb David
Arcos:<br>
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cite="mid:CAFB-oW3SfxV=q-WWLg2T65FP=7wq5g0iVPufwk6hxDcfA8ae1w@mail.gmail.com"
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<div class="gmail_quote">TL;DR: YMMV from country to country.</div>
<div class="gmail_quote"><br>
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<div class="gmail_quote"><br>
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<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Sep 24, 2012 at 8:42 PM, Thomas
Bruderer <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:apophis@apophis.ch" target="_blank">apophis@apophis.ch</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote">But if you would ask: would
you support a Liquid Democracy schema for the governement,
the answer would be as clearly: No, not all, this won't help
us to find the best solutions for our country.</blockquote>
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<br>
<div>Let's agree with you: DD/LD won't be the best for "your"
contry.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>However, your country is Switzerland. You already have
plenty of citizen participation tools!</div>
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<br>
Thats why I differntiate between direct democracy and liquid
feedback... I absolutly agree that participation is important, but I
want to make clear that there are very different options, and the
solutions might be very different from country to country. Every
state has a history which needs to be taken into account, OUR form
of direct democracy might not work in your country, and your form of
transparency might not work in our country. <br>
<br>
We should not have too specific targets, they need to be broad
enough so every party can fill it with their own ideas of how it
should work.<br>
<br>
We all will agree for more "Participation of citizens" but we won't
agree on something specific as "Liquid Democracy"!<br>
<br>
Be inclusive!<br>
<br>
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cite="mid:CAFB-oW3SfxV=q-WWLg2T65FP=7wq5g0iVPufwk6hxDcfA8ae1w@mail.gmail.com"
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<div class="gmail_quote">
<div><br>
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<div>The situation in my country (Spain) is very different. We
don't have Transparency, nor Participation: the transparency
law is a fake, we have no "open-government" or accountability
on public spending, we don't do referendums (they changed the
Constitution without asking the citizens first). Well, in
fact, <b>calling for a referendum is ilegal</b>, and will get
you to prison.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Given our situation, I can assure you that our
priorities are Transparency and Participation. Without both,
our political system is too corrupt, too undemocratic.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
I can understand that a Swiss pirate doesn't have the urgency
of improvement his Citizen Participation tools, and that for a
Swedish pirate it's not a priority to improve their
Transparency laws. But please understand this is not
universal, and that most of the contries have big gaps in both
issues.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Let's go further, and pick some more lower-level issues:
patented medicines, or patented food. As a Spanish, I never
had (day-to-day) problems with those issues. However, I can
see that it's a threat for millions of people in the world,
and for them it's a "pirate core issue" much more important
than repelling a three-strike law.</div>
<div><br>
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<div><br>
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<div>Best regards,</div>
</div>
<br>
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<pre wrap="">____________________________________________________
Pirate Parties International - General Talk
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net">pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general">http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general</a>
</pre>
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