<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 5 January 2013 09:26, Antonio Garcia <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ningunotro@hotmail.com" target="_blank">ningunotro@hotmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Andrew,<br>
<br>
The 2012 PPI GA was an almost complete failure on many aspects, and neither the Board nor the Court of Arbitration have shown much aptitude for duly and diligently performing their tasks.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>
We were so useless at doing things that the Board offered our resignation to the Swiss as a peace offering. I would put in our defence that we received about a million (okay, exaggerating slightly) complaints from, oddly enough, members of PPES. I think "swamped" is an appropriate description. Also, try operating without any ratified rules of procedure. The CoA is a bit of an oddity in that no official rules have been drawn up.</div>
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
The consequences are something we will probably have to suffer for quite some time, impacting on our ability to internationally organize and be of mutual assistance to each other.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>We don't actually need PPI to internationally organise, do we? We can all mutually assist one another without PPI. So therefore, it is redundant as far as I can tell.</div>
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
But that being said... I see no way to actually label a non-EU General Assembly of PPI as responsible behaviour. It would force way too many people to incur in expensive travel costs. Something more sensible might be to establish a solidarity mechanism whereby all delegates have equal costs and the fee is established in such a way that those closer to the premises pay a surplus that can be used to subsidize the costs of those that have no alternative than to come from further away.<br>
<br>
Optimization would then be to try to keep total cost of travel and lodging as low as possible.<br>
<br>
At some point organizing the PPI GA out of Europe could become efficient cost-wise, or interested parties could subsidize the difference between the cost-efficient solution and their preferred one... putting the money where their mouth is.<br>
<br>
Organizing a PPI GA out of Europe has not only to do with finding a suitable location... it has much more to do with people finding the funds to travel to wherever it is to be held.<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>You can always try being a remote delegate. It's really fun, especially when the moderator says, not realising his microphone is on: "I don't care about the remote delegates!" A non-Europe conference, after seven European conferences, would probably be a good idea just to acknowledge that there are other pirate parties out there. Maybe we'll get lucky with the ninth one. All I know is that generally speaking, PPAU is getting pretty fed up with the whole Eurocentricism thing, particularly as we have to be constantly on guard to defend ourselves against whatever shitstorm is happening over there.</div>
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
It can not be that deciders become only those that have money to travel around at will, considering the increased amount of international meetings being arranged lately. Meetings with little in the line of practical results, and very bad structure and timing, to add insult to injury, making thm less and less interesting for intelligent people to attend.<br>
<br></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Abandon PPI, or host meetings in cyberspace. I'm getting the feeling PPAU will be doing the former…</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<br>
Antonio.<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------<br>
> Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 16:15:25 -0500<br>
> From: <a href="mailto:ktetch@gmail.com">ktetch@gmail.com</a><br>
> To: <a href="mailto:pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net">pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net</a><br>
> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] What is democracy in a party<br>
<div class="HOEnZb"><div class="h5">><br>
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><br>
> On 1/4/2013 3:16 PM, Nicolás Reynolds wrote:<br>
> > Zbigniew Łukasiak <<a href="mailto:zzbbyy@gmail.com">zzbbyy@gmail.com</a>> writes:<br>
> ><br>
> >> On Thu, Dec 27, 2012 at 3:55 PM, Carlito <<a href="mailto:carlito@subvertising.org">carlito@subvertising.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> >>> So, if the majority expulses members and stop new subscribers you will always have the same "controllers" ad vitam.<br>
> >>><br>
> >>> IMHO this seems not being a "democratic organization" (the first rule should be alternance of government)<br>
> >><br>
> >> In my opinion the alternance of government is only an indicator of<br>
> >> democracy - if there is no government (i.e. no board in this case) you<br>
> >> can still have a democracy.<br>
> ><br>
> > i recommend the book "Freedom Is an Endless Meeting" from francesca<br>
> > polletta for other experiences :)<br>
><br>
> Was it based on the 2012 PPI GA?<br>
><br>
> I mean, we're still waiting for the statutes bit of day 2 (the whole<br>
> 'afternoon' of the agenda to be done, and the second half of what was<br>
> done (voting in the COA) is moot as well since they all resigned months ago.<br>
><br>
> (Although that's not really freedom, more general incompetence)<br>
><br>
> Next we'll find out that the PPI Board have failed to arrange a non-EU<br>
> location for the next PPI GA (and will claim it's nothing to do with<br>
> them not organizing one, just that no-one outside the EU will do their<br>
> job for them and organize it)<br>
><br>
><br>
> - --<br>
> Andrew Norton<br>
> <a href="http://ktetch.co.uk" target="_blank">http://ktetch.co.uk</a><br>
> Tel: +1(352)6-KTETCH <a href="tel:%5B%2B1-352-658-3824" value="+13526583824">[+1-352-658-3824</a>]<br>
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