<p>Interesting article for those who like to know more about this 5 star movement, originaly from Italian article :<br>
<a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/feb/28/five-star-movement-beppe-grillo">http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/feb/28/five-star-movement-beppe-grillo</a></p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mar 1, 2013 7:42 a.m., "Giulio Prisco" <<a href="mailto:giulio@gmail.com">giulio@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
Re "the severe issues in M5S' internal democracy.. or rather its lack of."<br><br>I hate saying this, but I am afraid the M5S wouldn't be where it is today with internal democracy.<br><br>Some Pirate Parties, including those in Italy (last time I checked there were 2) are paralyzed by lack of decision-making, internal bitchiness and infighting, and childish behavior on the mailing lists with mine-is-bigger-than-yours pissing contests and all that.<br>
<br>I am all for internal democracy but it is a difficult game to play, with some learning required.<br><br>In the meantime I hope Beppe Grillo will kick some ass in Italy, and kick it hard.<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">
On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 9:31 PM, carlo von lynX <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:lynX@pirate.my.buttharp.org" target="_blank">lynX@pirate.my.buttharp.org</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 03:27:03PM +0100, Cal. wrote:<br>
> Youngs are a strict minority, and they're probably voting the movement,<br>
> not the grillo leader???they could move any moment to a pirate party, if<br>
> they're not enough brainwashed.<br>
<br>
I'll elaborate on that...<br>
<br>
M5S has done an impressive job but as Pirates it is our duty<br>
to point our finger to the severe issues in M5S' internal<br>
democracy.. or rather its lack of.<br>
<br>
It is easy to have a beautiful party programme if others are<br>
writing it for you and you remain in full power to decide<br>
what choices the movement actually makes.<br>
<br>
Our criticism is well-known within the more active among the<br>
M5S activists (not necessarily the ones that comment in blogs)<br>
and shared by many of them, since they brought the topic up<br>
before us. We just developed our own opinion, read the statutes<br>
and came to the same conclusions.<br>
<br>
They are all just waiting for Grillo and his staff, the<br>
Casaleggio company, to fulfil the promises of making everyone<br>
take part in decisions and pass the movement into the hands of<br>
true grassroots, electronic or liquid democracy.<br>
<br>
And many important figures know that we are fighting out the<br>
extremely difficult next step: being a party without a board.<br>
So they are already looking at us to share our experience,<br>
the good and the bad, as "uno vale uno" - each person counts<br>
as one - is their essential party motto and they care very<br>
much for solutions to actually make this possible.<br>
<br>
There are four possible scenarios:<br>
<br>
- Grillo fulfills his promise and the movement starts<br>
practicing what it preaches. If they're so good that they<br>
even fulfil the core pirate dreams and get rid of their<br>
populist stuff in the current programme, a merger is not out<br>
of the question.. I say merger because our statutes are<br>
more suitable to the job then theirs - and I especially<br>
mean merger in the international perspective. I know how<br>
unimportant we are on a local level.<br>
<br>
- Grillo does not and a relevant number of activists<br>
leaves the movement to form its own party.<br>
<br>
- Grillo does not and a relevant number of activists<br>
leave to join the Pirate Party because we are ahead with<br>
our liquid directorate and maybe got it working by then.<br>
<br>
- Grillo does not and nothing happens. I presume in that case<br>
population will soon figure out that it just elected a new<br>
Berlusconi* and look for new alternatives. And that case<br>
the race is open again, and Italy is currently *very* fluid.<br>
<br>
<br>
*) AFAIK in 1994 Berlusconi launched his FORZA ITALIA movement<br>
in a similar way to Beppe Grillo, with a company running<br>
the party and allowing no democratic interference at all.<br>
The success was very similar. In 1994 it worked by television<br>
that Berlusconi happened to run. This time it was the Internet.<br>
<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div><br>
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