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<body class='hmmessage'><div dir='ltr'>Of course, Eduardo and Dario are absolutely right... looking at Partido X<br>from their specific points of view where they are in love with what they<br>call Direct Democracy.<br><br>But the champions of Direct Democracy and Horizontal Asamblearism are the<br>15M / Indignado / Occupy Movement...<br><br>... and these started as a popular outcry against the sellout of politicians<br>and union leaders because they were not able to understand why it always<br>and invariably had to happen.<br><br>At the onset, there were (they are still there) a few very anarchist types<br>(the wrong kind of anarchism) that were pushing for a total revolution<br>that would overthrow the present constitutional framework and start with a<br>tabula rasa a new Constituent Assembly that would come up with a new<br>democratic charter. What they were unable to understand... is that the ones<br>being inconvenienced by the present crisis were mostly middle class citizens<br>that would never rally behind an anarchist agenda... they value their<br>personal safety and private property too much and would rather support a<br>fascist outcome.<br><br>As they failed miserably in starting their anarchist revolution and had cut<br>all bridges towards reformist action from inside the actual political<br>structures... they have lost all momentum and are just turning in circles...<br>... being almost completely taken over by the left they had tried to leave<br>out of the picture for once. A left that has gone to great lengths to enlist<br>all these people in their proletarian army... because this crisis is their<br>chance to get their final proletarian victory.<br><br>Of course... that would lead to the same polarization of 49,5% red people<br>against the 49,5% of blue people we have all enjoyed sinse the start of the<br>cold war, and neverending exhaustion battles where scorched earth tactics<br>warrant us a bright future... no matter who the pyrrhic winner may be.<br><br>The only alternative is a politically rational proposition like the one the<br>Pirate Parties started, working from inside of the present political<br>establishment... that works around the left-right, red-blue divide and<br>really works to gather a political 99% around neutral humanist values.<br><br>Because once you efficienly argue in favour of humanism as a neutral<br>ideology... yo can logically and ethically dismantle both dogmatic<br>communism AND dogmatic fascism at the same time... without all the good<br>people resisting you without clues because you threathen lo leave them<br>ideologically orphaned without a replacement theory to turn to.<br><br><br>Just a few big cents of mine :)<br><br>Antonio<br>@SameDoKan<br><br><hr>From: i@dario.im<br>Date: Sun, 3 Mar 2013 12:43:08 +0100<br>To: pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net<br>Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Partido X - Partido del Futuro vs 5 Star Movement<br><br><div dir=ltr>What Eduardo said is absolutely true.<div><br></div><div>There is only one public name, the one of the president in Spanish official registry: <a href="https://servicio.mir.es/nfrontal/webpartido_politico/partido_politicoDatos.html?nmformacion=4774" target=_blank>https://servicio.mir.es/nfrontal/webpartido_politico/partido_politicoDatos.html?nmformacion=4774</a> (A popup will appear, it is how it works).</div>
<div><br></div><div>In my opinion they are really pirates, just with different branding. Founders come from 15-M movement (Indignados) and they put together several independent initiatives like Democracy 4.0 (some kind of liquid democracy on Parliament), etc.</div>
<div><br></div></div><div class=ecxgmail_extra><br><br><div class=ecxgmail_quote>2013/3/3 Eduardo Robles Elvira <span dir=ltr><<a href="mailto:edulix@gmail.com" target=_blank>edulix@gmail.com</a>></span><br>
<blockquote class=ecxgmail_quote style="border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div class=ecxHOEnZb><div class=h5>On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 10:00 AM, Carlito <<a href="mailto:carlito@subvertising.org">carlito@subvertising.org</a>> wrote:<br>
> Similar to the other topic: can someone from Spain tell us a bit more about<br>
> the Partido X (Partido del Futuro)?<br>
><br>
> I found their website and they are also making some benchmark analysis with<br>
> 5 Star Movement:<br>
><br>
> <a href="http://partidodelfuturo.net/movimiento-5-stelle-demuestra-que-es-posible/" target=_blank>http://partidodelfuturo.net/movimiento-5-stelle-demuestra-que-es-posible/</a><br>
><br>
> I’m curious to understand their internal structure because I can’t find the<br>
> common menu item “About Us”.<br>
><br>
> Is it an anomymous association?<br>
><br>
> In the FAQ in can read that they are not giving their names.<br>
><br>
> Is it legal in Spain to do that?<br>
><br>
> Best,<br>
><br>
> Carlito<br>
<br>
</div></div>Hello:<br>
<br>
Partido X is similar to M5S into that they have a good marketing<br>
campaign behind them. They announced themselves with a viral campaign<br>
(twitter, youtube videos etc) revolving around the idea that they're<br>
"the party of the future", that "in the future, we have already won",<br>
and that kind of stuff.<br>
<br>
But on the other side, it's the contrary with respect to public heads:<br>
they people behind it is an anonymous closed group of people who don't<br>
want to be known by their names but by their actions, in contrast with<br>
Beppe Grillo being the prominent leader of the movement.<br>
<br>
It's not legal to have a legally valid and registered political party<br>
in Spain with no registered board members, you at least need to have a<br>
president (well, the title of the person is up to you, but there needs<br>
to be at least one person). Partido_X does have a person who acts as a<br>
president of their party, but it's only one and doesn't play a<br>
prominent role. Even the actors that appear in the video were<br>
contracted for the video but they are not leaders of the movement.<br>
"hidden in plain sight" one might say.<br>
<br>
So it's all very confusing, which is part of their campaign I suppose.<br>
It's something new and that attracts attention. They had quite good<br>
exposure (appearing in TV etc) when they launched their campaign in<br>
January, but we have heard little of them since then.<br>
<br>
They're doing things though, preparing a website for people to propose<br>
items for their program, they have setup some kind of plan with<br>
different stages for going to the elections, they are for transparency<br>
(funny, ain't it?) and direct democracy, and their program in general<br>
seems quite similar to the pirates itself I think.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
Eduardo<br>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear=all><div><br></div>-- <br><div>Dario Castañé</div><div><a href="http://www.dario.im" target=_blank>http://www.dario.im</a> | <a href="http://twitter.com/im_dario" target=_blank>http://twitter.com/im_dario</a></div>
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