<div dir="ltr">I am deeply convinced that only people payed by government and similar organisations can sit in PP and wait for opportunity to do damage.Allow me to me remind you that title of this thread was freedom fight - and torrent was shared....<div>
<div><br></div><div>bye</div><div><br></div><div>JJ</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jan 3, 2014 at 2:23 AM, Stephen Ogden <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:s.ogden@pirateparty.org.uk" target="_blank">s.ogden@pirateparty.org.uk</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
Given you should be on the CoA Andrew, were denied your position due
to creative counting, and no elected PPI official cares enough for
the rules to challenge this, I won't be holding my breath for an
appropriate response to this from any PPI official.<br>
<br>
I am hesitant however to hold any PPI official <i>wholly</i>
responsible because the PPI is simply the sum of its parts and its
members have allowed it to continue to 'operate' in the manner that
it does.<br>
<br>
The reality is, in my opinion, that PPI is a valuable entity to have
in the long term, but that its members cannot (will not?) devote
sufficient attention to it in the short term. Until such a time as
they do it will continue to function (malfunction?) in the ad hoc,
shamelessly amateur, way that it currently does.<br>
<br>
I hope that sooner or later the constituent members <i>will</i>
realise (i) that while PPI can be valuable it currently makes a
mockery of what they stand for, and (ii) that they have to put in
the resources to reform it (or actually, just make it follow its own
rules). It does unfortunately look like PPI will have to hit rock
bottom before that happens, and it seems it hasn't hit rock bottom
yet - so that's something to look forward to.<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>
Stephen Ogden<br>
Governor of the Board - Pirate Party UK<br>
Pirate Party UK is a political party registered with the Electoral
Commission.</font></span><div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
On 02/01/2014 22:09, Andrew Norton wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Sorry about the delay, I had to check in
with some people before I wrote<br>
this publicly, since it references some people and information I
have,<br>
and I wanted to be sure they were all ok with it.<br>
<br>
On 12/26/2013 2:24 PM, Jelena Jovanovic wrote:<br>
> FYI<br>
<br>
> Andrew Northon is banned from all known pirate pages for
trolling and<br>
> hate speech. Answers bashing out Hammond he received more
than once.<br>
Yes, Jelena, the 'hate speech' was that I wasn't going to do free
work<br>
for your 'pr company' any more. Or was it the linking to a
screening of<br>
TPB AFK I was hosting, when you linked to the torrent. As you're
'admin'<br>
you can see all the posts you've marked as 'deleted' so seeing my<br>
comment shouldn't be a problem, and you can easily screenshot this
nasty<br>
'trolling' I was doing. If you need help finding it, it was<br>
<a href="https://www.facebook.com/ppinternational/posts/710020175691046" target="_blank">https://www.facebook.com/ppinternational/posts/710020175691046</a>.
(Running<br>
the TorrentFreak page means I have to delete all kinds of trolling
and<br>
spamming all the time, so I know what you can and can't do)<br>
<br>
You know I sent screenshots of the incident (including the
'troll')<br>
response to my PPI rep at the PPUK. Ones like this
<a href="http://db.tt/EG1KfXOG" target="_blank">http://db.tt/EG1KfXOG</a><br>
<br>
Or was it the 'trolling' where I pointed out that the people
running<br>
Kazan's elections weren't following their own procedures, and when
it<br>
was pointed out that the elections were run improperly, the
response was<br>
'you could have objected at the time and not a month later' Except
I did<br>
ask about the results the next day<br>
(<a href="http://lists.pirateweb.net/pipermail/pp.international.general/2013-April/014107.html" target="_blank">http://lists.pirateweb.net/pipermail/pp.international.general/2013-April/014107.html</a>)<br>
but it was raised within hours of the results being published<br>
(<a href="http://lists.pirateweb.net/pipermail/pp.international.general/2013-May/014159.html" target="_blank">http://lists.pirateweb.net/pipermail/pp.international.general/2013-May/014159.html</a>).<br>
So trolling is now 'raising legitimate questions about the
validity and<br>
integrity of elections and their results'?<br>
<br>
It seems if your allegations were true, then you should be able to<br>
provide PLENTY of evidence to support this. Except you can't,
because<br>
you don't have any. It's just more ooh, *censorship* (although I
loathe<br>
to use the word) against your critics.<br>
<br>
But hey, Jelena, it's not like there isn't a load of reporters and
media<br>
on this list, who who note who says what, or that you don't
represent<br>
any of the Pirate Ideals.<br>
<br>
hey Court Of Arbitration, any chance we can get a look into
Jelena's<br>
actions, and how she's acting on behalf of the PPI in an arbitrary
and<br>
capricious matter? (I did check the Board meeting minutes, but the
last<br>
one is November 12, so either they've not held a meeting since in<br>
violation of the statutes and their RoP, or they've not bothered
with<br>
the basics of minuting them, again a RoP violation as well as one
of<br>
basic transparency)<br>
Nevertheless, the actions by Jelena took place in August after a
PPI<br>
post about 'sexy PPI admins' was commented upon as her fishing for<br>
compliments (<a href="https://db.tt/OBEzfCKM" target="_blank">https://db.tt/OBEzfCKM</a> - yes, that's the 'trolling'),
and I<br>
see no mention of that in any minutes, leading me to suspect it
was<br>
unilateral action by a supposed representative of PPI for personal
reasons.<br>
<br>
We have people doing things in the name of PPI, that are
antithetical to<br>
Pirate Politics. We have had questionable 'elections', arbitrary<br>
actions, and undocumented 'meetings'. It's not the kind of actions
we<br>
like to promote, indeed it's the very actions we formed to
condemn.<br>
<br>
It's probably why another quite senior member for a member party,
has<br>
told me "it seems PPI is in the business of trying to make PPI
look<br>
functional and mask, rather than fix the issues that are present".
It's<br>
why major issues like the bank accounts still haven't been sorted,
or<br>
the rules followed, but but we have to make conferences look good.<br>
Seriously, look over the 'minutes'. There's lots of excuses why
major<br>
things don't get done, but lots of boasting about conferences
attended<br>
and speeches given (at least by those that can bother turning up).<br>
<br>
We again, furiously bang at our keyboards, demanding officials
take<br>
account for their actions, and get rid of the useless and
ineffective,<br>
and yet we have PPI which has becomes totally unfit for purpose.
And<br>
stunts like the WTO are not helping either. In Bali (according to
those<br>
I have spoken to) they did a lot of talking, but when it came to<br>
presenting a paper, it had all the substance of a tweet (if you've
not<br>
read it, it's at<br>
<a href="http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/minist_e/mc9_e/ngo_ppi_e.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.wto.org/english/thewto_e/minist_e/mc9_e/ngo_ppi_e.pdf</a>).
It is<br>
just a 'hey, this would be a good idea' without substantive
background,<br>
references, data, or information. You could replace it with this
tweet<br>
and lose nothing.<br>
"more #copyright thn eva. Try #publiclicenses, would be cool.
Thanks<br>
#votepirate"<br>
Of course, the reason is it was mostly done on a pad 12 hours
before.<br>
gotta love planning, considering there were 2 weeks notice at
least.<br>
<br>
So here's the thing. Don't go telling everyone else you're
pirates, if<br>
you're only a pirate when it comes to others. Otherwise you're
just like<br>
the law enforcement that looks the other way when another cop
breaks the<br>
law. Mainly because when you break your own rules and principles
(and<br>
PPI has done that over and over) then you end up losing any<br>
justification to criticize those that have done the same.<br>
<br>
I also wonder what sort of reception/opinion those PPI officers
would<br>
have for whistleblowers, if it were them the whistle was being
blown on.<br>
I'd guess they wouldn't be too fond then. I know I don't have
anything<br>
to fear from them, for instance, because I always follow the
rules. I<br>
may annoy people, certainly, but in every case, it's always
because I<br>
follow the rules and principles of the Pirate wheel, and look for
long<br>
term gains, rather than a short-term goal. People that have a
problem<br>
with that, might want to ask themselves "are you sure you're a
pirate?"<br>
<br>
Andrew<br>
<br>
<br>
> Keep up with your "activism", Northon. <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
> On Thu, Dec 26, 2013 at 1:10 PM, Antonio Garcia
<<a href="mailto:ningunotro@hotmail.com" target="_blank">ningunotro@hotmail.com</a><br>
> <a href="mailto:ningunotro@hotmail.com" target="_blank"><mailto:ningunotro@hotmail.com></a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
> > Date: Thu, 26 Dec 2013 01:31:12 -0500<br>
> > From: <a href="mailto:ktetch@gmail.com" target="_blank">ktetch@gmail.com</a>
<a href="mailto:ktetch@gmail.com" target="_blank"><mailto:ktetch@gmail.com></a><br>
> > To: <a href="mailto:pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net" target="_blank">pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net</a><br>
>
<a href="mailto:pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net" target="_blank"><mailto:pp.international.general@lists.pirateweb.net></a><br>
> > Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] freedom fight movie<br>
<br>
> ><br>
> > Be ignorant, be foolish all you want. But do so in
your own name,<br>
> don't<br>
> > drag me and everyone else down by trying to make
that guttersnipe seem<br>
> > hard done by, especially with all the harm he's done
our cause<br>
> > politically. The enemy of my enemy is not my friend.
Hammond was<br>
> never a<br>
> > friend of the Pirates, we were just a means for him
to try and get<br>
> more<br>
> > followers. And if you think otherwise, then you
never met Hammond, or<br>
> > are too busy lying to yourself to be objective.<br>
> ><br>
> > TL;DR<br>
> > Hammond is not a hero, never was, and any attempt to
portray him<br>
> as such<br>
> > will only ever backfire on us.<br>
> ><br>
> > Andrew<br>
<br>
> After Prague 2012 misbehaviour and the whole plot to keep
its<br>
> consequences out of sight in Kazan/Brussels 2013... if
anyone thinks<br>
> we need anything stupid additional to drag the whole
pirate movement<br>
> down to plain nothingness then he is just a playing
kiddy.<br>
<br>
> Someone ThinkTwice :(.<br>
<br>
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