[pp.int.general] "Natural" law
Carlos Ayala Vargas
aiarakoa at yahoo.es
Wed Jan 7 18:10:02 CET 2009
Reinier Bakels wrote:
> Of course, many people argue about human rights all the time. But the
> actual effect on legislation in Western Europe afaik is minor, and not
> always in a desirable direction.
I think that's due to two things:
- pirate parties are rather recent, too recent to have already achieved
- the effect on legislation in Western Europe is actually made by
political parties; if, in Spain, 323 out of 350 seats belong to only two
parties, those parties agree on obeying pro-copyright lobbies and most
citizens believe that only one of those two parties can prevail, how
would they gonna make it? punishing one by voting the other one? only
when pirate parties get a major role, the effect on legislation will
also be major -and in the desirable direction-
> I may recall that many politicians support the idea of tough copyright
> enforcement in order to learn youngsters again to respect property.
> "Today they steal a MP3, tomorrow a bycycle". Property needs to be
> respected. A basic human right.
A basic lie from traditional politicians: intellectual works (namely and
using the same example, MP3-formatted songs) are not property, thus
cannot be stolen. And I believe that lies have to be countered and
denied; rather than prevent us to defend human rights, I believe that
those lies and distortions should even encourage us more to defend human
> Sorry, my command of Spanish is very limited.
Just pay attention to the numbers -they are almost universal-: sum the
three amounts, and you'll have about 3 million signatures collected by
/Todos Contra el Canon/ against levies. However, as long as Spanish
Congress is ruled by PSOE & PP -with the help of IU and nationalist
parties, most or even all of them obeying pro-copyleft lobbies-, no
matter whether 3 or 33 million signatures are collected ... we need to
enter the Congress and nail seats to make a real effect.
>> huh? /non-written intellectual pro...whatever/ law? Which is that law?
> This is controversial item among lawyers.
If law is /non-written/, not even in case law form, who cares about it?
I believe that judges making judgments according to /non-written/ laws,
nor to case-law, violates law essentials. Remember: it is essential that
human rights should be protected by the rule of law.
> The mainstream is that copyright/authors right/patents/trademark
> law/design model law and a few other *explicitly* codified fields are
> exceptions to the rule of information.The minority perception is that
> there is a generalised right associated with all intellectual
> achievements, even if not explicitly codified.
Only two viewpoints? I disagree:
- UDHR's 27.2, and United Nations, acknowledge author's rights as human
rights -also 27.1, and United Nations, acknowledges citizens' rights on
- however, we in PIRATA reject the usage of /non-written/ laws; only
rule of law is acceptable for us -of course, we also aim to make the law
following certain standards, among others, being the law that citizens
actually want (not the one wanted only by MPs or the ones who influence
That's a third viewpoint; and there may be some more.
> Infringements will be handled my tort law, which is usually open ended
> (in NL it is, en DE it is not, elsewhere I don't know)
What is /my tort law/?
> One of the professors at Utrecht University promotes unwritten
> intellectual property rights (e.g. "goodwill"), but another professor,
> his former PhD supervisor told me that he hated his ideas (but the PhD
> candidate is allowed to have a different opinion than his supervisor ...)
As I said, I also hate the idea of anyone even trying to force me to
pledge allegiance to /non-written/,
/non-passed-by-parliaments-nor-referendum/ laws. /Goodwill/? I see the
/will/ -of pro-copyright lobbies-, though I don't see the /good/ in
there -I believe that, where is lack of rules, the strongest prevail ...
and often abuses; and currently pro-copyright lobbies are the strongest
( Aiarakoa )
Partido Pirata National Board's Chairman
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