[pp.int.general] "Natural" law

[Carlos Ayala Vargas]

While I'm keen to follow Jorge, David, Andy and others' advice and 
continue this in PPI forum, if Reinier rejects this too and continues 
the debate here in the PPI list, it would make no sense to reply him 
there; thus, until Reinier accepts to move this debate to the PPI forum, 
I'll have to continue replying him here.

Reinier Bakels wrote:
> As a matter of principle, our political opponents deserve to be 
> respected as well, as long as they are not plainly corrupt.
As a matter of principle, beyond what law obliges me -i.e., slandering, 
offences and such things are prohibited-, I don't have political respect 
to those who repeated and systematically threat our civil rights and 
liberties:

- Lourdes Muñoz Santamaria
- Beatriz Rodriguez-Salmones
- Rafael Simancas
- Ignacio Echaniz
- Cesar Antonio Molina
- Gaspar Llamazares
- etc
> I object against a "lier" qualification.
Fine. Then how would you consider then anyone who lies? I mean, suggest 
me an alternative word with same meaning.
> Both in the field of immaterial goods and the field of privacy the 
> issue is not black and white, and there is room for interpretation.
Now it's quarter to five here in Spain; Sun is still visible, thus it's 
not night yet. And that has, in my opinion, no room for interpretation: 
day is day, night is night, and without any sort of eclipse, frontiers 
are pretty well defined.

Same, if anyone wants to monitor *all* internet accounts with the excuse 
of protecting author's rights, *no matter whether people actually 
infringe them or not*, it violates our privacy; and also has, in my 
opinion, no room for interpretation, but for distortion.
> If you don't trust politicians, read the professional literature. And 
> if you believe that most scholars are liers too - it becomes pathetic.
Again? Now you call me /pathetic/ -because of course I don't trust 
Spanish traditional politicians, and I've already stated that I don't 
trust many of those scholars you talk about-? How you dare ... you 
always do the same, you make absolute statements -often without sources 
nor evidences-, and if I disagree, then you insult me. Enough, man -not 
going to consider anyone who calls me /pathetic/ as a gentleman-.
> The fact of the matter is that we make different trade-offs. That is 
> the normal level to make politics.
The only trade-off made by Spanish traditional politicians is whether 
the must please Telefonica and, incidentally, the rest of ISPs, or the 
pro-copyright lobbies; and if both agree, there is no more trade-offs 
-as Spanish traditional politicians never include us in the scales, we 
are never in their minds; again, there were no rejection votes against 
2006 /IP/ law in Spanish Congress, and however there are 3 million 
signatures against several parts of it-.
> The arguments can not be found in fundamental rights or other legal 
> constructs.
You don't find them there; I do; Per does; Bravo, de la Cueva, Sanchez 
Almeida and other Spanish lawyers do; respect us.


                                                                                              
Carlos Ayala
                                                                                              
( Aiarakoa )

                                                                        
Partido Pirata National Board's Chairman