[pp.int.general] Italian Pirate Party - Scandal

[Mozart Olbrycht-Palmer]

Antonio…an honest question here.

Over the past year or so since I've been on this list, and for the  
three or four months I was on the Court of Arbitration, I have not  
actually heard you say much that is positive.

In fact, you seem very quick to criticise and very slow to offer any  
solutions.

I appreciate that you have problems with me, and the rest of the  
current/previous CoA, but they seem more about causing trouble than  
anything else. You seem intent on removing the Catalonian Pirates, and  
I am not sure what this obsession is about. Surely Pirates should be  
inclusive, not discriminatory.

So, Antonio, what are your solutions for fixing the state of the  
movement?

On 25/09/2012, at 11:06 PM, Antonio Garcia wrote:

> The possible problems concerning the actual governance model of the  
> Pirate Party of Italy... could and have been completely anticipated,  
> and reality is confirming the hypotheses.
>
> I find it extremely funny that Muriel has the guts to come out  
> lecturing about what she understands well and what everybody should  
> do to solve this case, considering all the trouble Pirates de  
> Catalunya has caused and is still causing in the PPI, using  
> blackmail to the PPI GA 2012 and ridiculing its Court of Arbitration  
> to the point it has had to resign in full so as to avoid the PPI  
> being put on trial before ordinary courts of justice over the  
> results of the Prague GA.
>
> The fact that Catalan Pirates are much liked among the populist  
> oriented pirate parties, and less among the serious ones might start  
> a serious Civil War in Pirate Universe.
>
> Issues pending at this Court of Arbitration that will resume as soon  
> as it is reconstituted will inevitably lead to them being kicked out  
> of PPI full membership at least, as their admission was in breach of  
> present Statutes, no reward for blackmail can ever be accepted by  
> true Pirates, and the resolution of the CoA that judged questionably  
> about the meaning of the word "Country" in the Statutes of PPI to  
> grant Spain an unasked for second Gibraltar in Catalonia, and  
> fraudulently rephrased one of the articles of the Statutes to grant  
> the General Assembly more discretionary decision power on the  
> admittance of new members than she really has (sidetracking for the  
> Catalonian Pirate Party provisions in the Statutes that were  
> strictly observed to reject the application of other Pirate  
> Parties), will be declared void.
>
> I have no clue, yet, about what happened in the Serbian Pirate  
> Party, but I certainly am not admitting a mere "case solved, walk  
> around, nothing to see here" issued by one of the involved parts as  
> enough to consider it solved. I'll consider evidence presented  
> before a court... by both sides.
>
>
> Amateurish proceeding and excessive leniency and self-indulgence on  
> behalf of the delegates of too many Pirate Parties caused the PPI  
> unavoidable troubles during the GA of 2012, building on similar  
> mischief in previous ones, and is having now and will have future  
> consequences the behaviour of some on the board is only stalling.
>
> Our proven inability to agree on how to proceed with PPEU is a  
> result of the previously existing mess that will have to be sorted  
> out thoroughly as soon as possible... if we do not want troubles to  
> accumulate, only to burst into severe inconveniences at the most  
> inappropriate of moments.
>
> My 2 cents, highly appreciated by some, and hated by others, but  
> mine by birthright ;) .
>
>
> Antonio.
> PP-ES
>
>
> Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 14:00:28 +0200
> From: piratska.partija.srbije at gmail.com
> To: pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Italian Pirate Party - Scandal
>
> +1 on Muriel's email
>
> About "Serbian case", it is solved. Racists like Jelena Jovanovic  
> (sad but true, she is still engaged with PPI, which opens another  
> serious question) and homophobes are out and banned from Serbian  
> Pirate Party.
>
> We are sailing steady now.
>
> *I see that additional informations on our "case" are needed. they  
> are ready, and they will follow soon
> **this "chase" for PPI legitimization and whining for membership is  
> rather interesting (since PPI board has at least one very  
> questionable person), PPI is becoming TV-style myth of public  
> legitimization imho
>
> On 09/25/2012 01:32 PM, MRE wrote:
> Dear Pilar,
>
> So, if I understood well, to register to the Italian Pirate Party you
> need that someone who is already a member somehow certifies the new
> members.
>
> And all these people that you represent and want to vote in the
> Italian liquid feedback system have been certified in particular by
> Carlo Brancati, who has been, if I understood correctly, at least
> partly banned from some PP-IT lists and the liquid feedback system
> through a voting in the liquid feedback itself?
>
> For the PPI to issue any kind of arbitration on this issue, all
> parties (the people who want to become members, PP-IT, and the PPI
> itself) should agree that this is what they want. Then I guess a
> comission of qualified volunteers or something of the sort should be
> formed so that they can investigate the matter in depth.
>
> Any opinion we state in this list is basically useless, because PPI
> does not rule over the parties, and this list does not represent PPI
> anyway. I believe that if you all want/accept PPI as an arbitrator you
> should send a formal request to the board.
>
> Best regards,
>
>                 Muriel
>
>
>
> 2012/9/25 Pilar Saavedra <pilarsaavedra.p at gmail.com>:
> Dear PP International,
>
>
>
> I represent here 35 people from various fields (IT professionals,
> Journalists and Media/Communication Managers) that are waiting to be
> inserted in the Italian Pirate Party since 3 months now.
>
> We have been regularly certified and we paid the subscription fees.
>
> You can find all the forms with original signatures here:
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/caafv4ianc7l7fg/RE6_FBQTqN
>
>
>
> The problem is clear: the subscription would give us also the right  
> to vote
> in Liquid Feedback witch is binding and fully decisional by Statutes  
> for the
> PP IT.
>
> So it’s quite clear that the Liquid Feedback administrator is not  
> inserting
> us because he’s afraid that we will vote against his (or his group of
> friends?) proposals and we could take the control of the Party…
>
>
>
> Isn’t this a real paradox and scandal for a Party that wants to  
> promote
> transparency, openness and liquid democracy?
>
> I really hope that someone from the PP Int can take charge of this  
> because
> it’s simply destroying the Pirates’ reputation even at an  
> international
> level.
>
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>
>
> Pilar Saavedra
>
>
> ____________________________________________________
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> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
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>
> ____________________________________________________
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>
>
> -- 
> I prefer to have options, rather than plans.
> Aleksandar Blagojevic aka blaeks
> former PPI board member
> founder of Pirate party of Serbia
>
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