[pp.int.general] Basic income - how does that fit into the pirate ideology?

[illunatic at greenpirate.org]

1) Is it opt-in only?
2) Where will the savings come from?

Quoting Travis McCrea <me at travismccrea.com>:

> That is a silly argument --
> 1) not every citizen would take advantage of it, that's like asking  
> if Switzerland could afford the cost of paying every single person's  
> unemployment.
> 2) You are neglecting the overhead costs of the current welfare  
> systems in addition to what the current welfare systems are paying out
>
> in many cases there will be a net /savings/ by switching to mincome.
>
> On 2013-07-16, at 2:42 PM, illunatic at greenpirate.org wrote:
>
>> Do you have a source to show that Switzerland actually has the  
>> means to fun ?237.360.000.000 annually to pay each citizen ?2.500  
>> per month? If this is not the amount people would receive, please  
>> feel free to adjust the math for more or less annual cost.
>>
>> Quoting Anouk <jakobsheep at gmail.com>:
>>
>>> Small sarcastic footnote, Switserland is a country  that has the funds to
>>> do this. And we all now how.
>>>
>>> MrNatural
>>> On Jul 16, 2013 6:53 PM, "Charly Pache" <charly.pache at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Here the swiss example on what will be added to the constitution if the
>>>> citizen approve the basic income votation, it's quite simple, then the
>>>> parliament will have to write the corresponding laws (the whole transition
>>>> process will take many years):
>>>> The Constitution is amended as follows:
>>>>
>>>> Art. 110a (new) unconditional basic income
>>>>
>>>>     1. The Confederation shall ensure the establishment of an  
>>>> unconditional
>>>> basic income.
>>>>
>>>>     2. The basic income should allow all people to lead a  
>>>> dignified life and
>>>> to participate in public life.
>>>>
>>>>     3. The law regulates such funding and the amount of basic income.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jul 16, 2013 at 5:58 PM, Daniel Riaño <danielrr2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Which Pirate parties included the idea of a "basic income" in the core of
>>>>> its ideology and/or their electoral program? And which specific model of
>>>>> "basic income" was that?
>>>>>
>>>>> To be able to talk about this subject meaningfully I think we should
>>>>> describe which model of basic income each has in mind.
>>>>>
>>>>> Of course we can speak in pure philosophical terms without the need to
>>>>> refer to any specific model, but then we should start by defining the
>>>>> anthropological basis of "basic income".
>>>>>
>>>>> best,
>>>>>
>>>>> Daniel
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2013/7/16 Zbigniew ?ukasiak <zzbbyy at gmail.com>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Most of the voices here were in favour of Basic Income.  The general
>>>>>> public is probably much more reserved about it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We are a group selected for our attitude towards copyright, patents
>>>>>> and privacy reforms - now we see that we share more than that.  Why is
>>>>>> that?  What is the thing that links these subjects?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Z.
>>>>>> ____________________________________________________
>>>>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>>>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>>>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ____________________________________________________
>>>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> societal activist @ utilopia.com, pirate party switzerland, ch-open.ch,
>>>> swiss entrepreneurship association and bien-ch.ch
>>>>
>>>> ____________________________________________________
>>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ____________________________________________________
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>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>
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