[pp.int.general] FORMAL COMPLAINT ABOUT THE ADMINISTRATION/MODERATION OF PPI MAILING LISTS

[Thijs Markus]

Antonio: I dunno how many people are on this mailing list, but half the 
mails are yours. How about you limit yourself to one mail a day, think 
over a bit what you write down, make it a logical, consice series of 
statements, and we stop deleting your mails unread, as I'm sure everyone 
is doing.

Antonio Garcia schreef op 22.06.2013 20:44:
> Freedom of speech should be no alien concept to pirates, dear
> brethren.
>
> And justice is not serviced by silencing the victims.
>
> Maybe, only maybe... you should review you conscience.
>
> Antonio.
>
> -------------------------
> To: pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> From: adrian.ppgr at gmail.com
> Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 21:36:32 +0300
> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] FORMAL COMPLAINT ABOUT THE
> ADMINISTRATION/MODERATION OF PPI MAILING LISTS
>
>  You guys apparently have a difficulty to grasp the concept of 
> "enough
> already". It is becoming sad.
>
> ----- Reply message -----
> From: "Antonio Garcia" <ningunotro at hotmail.com>
> To: "Pirate Parties International -- General Talk"
> <pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net>
> Subject: [pp.int.general] FORMAL COMPLAINT ABOUT THE
> ADMINISTRATION/MODERATION OF PPI MAILING LISTS
> Date: Sat, Jun 22, 2013 21:09
>
> I did run for office... and got elected. I am an officially elected
> member of the board of the Spanish Pirate Party.
>
> That makes me ONE, in a minority position within a sadly not cured of
> disfunctionality board, in a not cured of disfunctionality party.
>
> I guess previous and present members of the Board of PPI know how
> frustrating it is when the majority of an organ they belong to is
> unable to tacle issues in a logically, ethically and rule abiding way
> with a diligence showing that some intelligence is present and having
> effects.
>
> Dealing with such an issue in Spain is enough of a job.
>
> Imagine if what has been done to me since the shit in Prague had been
> done to me being a member of the board of PPI.
>
> Imagine if on top of the shit done to me in Kazan/Brussels... I had
> candidated for a post on the Board... and been elected if only for
> lack of any more appreciated candidate.
>
> No, friend... I took the chance with the Board of the Spanish Pirate
> Party because there was a possibility, which did NOT materialise, to
> have a majority of intelligent and committed pirates elected and then
> a cure for the parties long-time ilnesses applied.
>
> I see none such possibility for the PPI remotely available.
>
> That is why I did not candidate for anything PPI.
>
> That is also the reason why, despite the fact that at the time I 
> spent
> 1/3 of my total "wealth" to be present in Prague in order to share
> ideas and strategies of mine with the Pirate Movement, I kept my 
> mouth
> shut while the "Catalan" issue got no satisfying answer. It has shown
> itself as the only right thing to do... as it is dangerous to put red
> triggers in the hands of crooks and kids.
>
> And as the movement continues not to be able to live up to the values
> it purportedly heralds...
>
> ... it may become unavoidable to split away from the crooks and the
> kids in order to be able to acomplish anything useful at all.
>
> We will undoubtedly analyse how far that might eventually go, if at
> all possible and somehow useful.
>
> Can't be done in a few days, though.
>
> Antonio.
>
> -------------------------
> Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 18:18:18 +0100
> From: nuno.cardoso at pp-international.net
> To: pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] FORMAL COMPLAINT ABOUT THE
> ADMINISTRATION/MODERATION OF PPI MAILING LISTS
>
> On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 5:05 PM, Antonio Garcia
> <ningunotro at hotmail.com [1]> wrote:
>
>> Thank you, Nuno. Very telling this time.
>
> Always glad to help...
>
>> So, pretty much... if it does not have "leaders" in it it is not
>> official?
>
> That is not what I said. I said it's not official because it isn't 
> run
> by the PPI, how could it even be official? ;-)
>
> And nobody can s
>
>> own criteria. Of course the "leaders" lists are for
>> "representatives"/"delegates"/"leaders", whatever name t
>  PP members deem to call the persons from their party responsible to
> be there in their behalf. Some PP's don't even have "leaders". But of
> course they need to be accredited, otherwise impostors may appear and
> claim to speak on anyone's behalf, you wouldn't want that, now would
> you?
>
> just as I was phisically prevented from getting on the mic in 
> Brussels
> because nobody from the "leaders" wanted me to mention what had to be
> said... part of what is considered s
>
>> Were you an official delegate of a member? If yes, then that member
>> PP should complain if "leaders" from other members prevented their
>> official delegate from addressing the GA. If you were not an
>> official delegate then you can't normally a
>  unless you run for some kind of office.
>
> If you can't bring your PP, or any other member, to back you up, for
> whatever reason, and you wish to have a more individual participation
> on the pirate movement organizations then you should join Pirates
> Without Borders since their membership is made up of individuals and
> not institutions.
>
> You could also try forking the PPI as you said you would and see how
> that goes.
>
> But of course, to be a real pirate you don't even need to depend on
> institutions, be they Pirate Parties, organizations of Pirate 
> Parties,
> organizations of individual Pirates, etc, you only need to follow the
> Pirate ideals and be constructive about it, and if you do something
> awesome, people will flock to it in your lead. How about that awesome
> solution for everyone to become a pirate supporter brewing in your
> head that you never told anyone just because...well, because of
> whatever... :-P
>
> I guess the few ethicless apparatchik that run PPI since it started
> can keep the empty embarassing bag it has become...
>
> No matter how much some try to make it so, PPI isn't an "embarrassing
> bag", some threads of the cloth t
>
>> v>
> ="ltr">The bureaucrats that run the "official channels" do not care
> how the kids play :-) .
>
> Why haven't you run for office then? You could then help change 
> things
> you disagree with. How about that for a change? Or are you just
> another embarrassed thread of the great pirate cloth? ;-)
>
> Pirate regards,
> Nuno
>
> Links:
> ------
> [1] mailto:ningunotro at hotmail.com