[pp.int.general] Collecting signatures for 2009 European Election, and other requirements

Andrew Norton andrew.norton at pirate-party.us
Fri Jul 11 20:49:56 CEST 2008

Carlos Ayala wrote:
> ----- Mensaje original ----
> De: Ole Husgaard <pirat at sparre.dk>
> Enviado: viernes, 11 de julio, 2008 19:06:40
>> I have a local journalist who wants to write about the high number of
> signatures needed in Denmark to participate in
>> elections. So I am very interested in this information.
> You mean you have info about this issue, or that you're requesting info
> about this issue? If you're requesting and you need additional info
> about European Election in Spain's requirements, feel free to ask

Might I also suggest setting up a wiki page with this info (and
references). It also means we can tout it as a 'democracy reference' as

We're trying to do the same thing here with US state ballot requirements.


> Carlos Ayala skrev:
>> > In today's Pirate Manifesto session, Partia Piratow representative
> told that in Poland 100.000!!! signatures are
>> > required,
>> To be fair, only 5000 signatures are needed to run for elections.
> Poland is divided into about 40 election districts, and
>> you need 5000 signatures in a district to participate in elections in
> that district. If you have your 5000 signatures in
>> more than half the districts, you can participate in elections in all
> districts.
> Actually, to concur for the Spanish 54 MPs you need 15.000 signatures
> while to concur for the Polish 54 MPs they need 100.000 signatures; it
> has to be noted that there are 45 million Spaniards and 38 million
> Polish, so I don't find any logic in such huge amount of signatures
> required to Partia Piratow -requiring far more signatures in a country
> with slightly less eligible voters-. It seems unfair, like if Polish
> Election law were aimed to prevent tiny parties from concurring to
> elections.
>> > and Ole Husgaard talked about 70.000 in Denmark, Quite huge amounts,
> indeed.
>> And very hard to get: You have to get full name, address and SSN
> besides the signature. And the signature has to be
>> sent to the right one of about 200 local cencus registration offices
> depending on the address of the signer. The census
>> office then certifies that the signature is good and from a voter, and
> sends it back to the signer. The signer then has
>> to buy an envelope and stamp and mail his certified signature back to
> the party (this extra step is called confirming
>> the signature. In particular the last step is bad. In reality we need
> to collect about 150000-200000 signatures to end up
>> with the 70000 certified and confirmed signatures. And this is in a
> country with only about 3.5 million voters.
> :O In Spain we need full name, town census where the eligible voter is
> registered, birthdate and ID number, and also an informed consent
> because of Private Data Law -signatories have to informedly consent us
> to manage their private data until such data is delivered to the
> Election Board; this informed consent is made simultaneously together
> with the signing of the official MIR (Ministry of Interior) form-
> However, we don't have such other requirements you describe, it's simply
> frightening!!!
> It's not only the huge amount of signatures which matters, it's also the
> procedure.
>> > How about the rest of pirate parties, which requirements do they
> have to face?
>> In Sweden they need 1500 signatures to participate in local parliament
> elections. I don't know if the number of
>> signatures is different for EP elections in SE
> Considering that there are 5 times more voters in Spain than in Sweden,
> it's like if Sweden were required half of Spanish signatures ... 13'33
> times less signatures than in Poland ... and ... roughly 100 times less
> signatures than in Denmark!!!
> Very huge differences between Member States, don't understand why
> European Election rules are so heterogeneous from one Member State to
> another. Regards,
> Carlos Ayala
> ( Aiarakoa )
>                                                            Partido
> Pirata National Board's Chairman
> P.S.: While homogeneization uses to be a good option, I'm afraid that
> Sarkozy & Co. would choose, as a model to converge to ... the Danish
> model -which would imply, in a country like Spain, to require us to
> collect  ... 700.000 signatures!!! (actually 1'5-2 million signatures,
> as Ole points)-.
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