[pp.int.general] The conference - what went wrong, and why we NEED to do better!

Fri Apr 23 02:04:45 CEST 2010

Thanks for the valuable feedback Andrew, the new board shall work on
being more effective.

- Nicolas
   PPI

2010/4/22, Andrew Norton <ktetch at gmail.com>:
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> On 4/22/2010 5:24 PM, Alex wrote:
>> ok no need to get into details., let's discuss all that when we have 7
>> strong european parties. so far it doesnt look too promissing. PP-DE
>> is growing slowly, SE is losing members, FI is showing some potential.
>> and that's pretty much it.
>
> I think the swedish losses are overstated. It's only to be expected
> given their membership model. Instead of looking at the negative
> numbers, look at the positive - how many, of their own will, have renewed?
>
> As for other parties, the Dutch party has a chance (0.67% is all they
> need for a national seat, I believe) and the UK party, while a seat is
> unlikely, has strong potential to grow some more in these last two weeks
> before the election.
>
> That reminds me, I'm not speaking officially for anyone but myself,
> however, one thing PPI should be doing is supporting parties during
> elections. The UK party is 2 weeks away from an elcetion. The Dutch
> party is a day under 7 weeks away from theirs. Sweden has an election in
> September, and I believe there's another one that I can't remembre
> offhand. The success of these parties, directly affects our own parties.
> The better the election results, the more credible we are as a political
> position.
>
> Additionally, I'm sure we're all shorter on experience (direct, hands on
> experience) than we'd like. So, why not get some. If you have free time,
> ask a party with a looming election if they need help. Mostly they'll
> need creative people, working on flyers, videos etc (because it's not
> feasible for someone in Spain, Sweden or Serbia to be helping trudge the
> streets of Bury handshaking and doorknocking). Maybe share, adapt and
> remix material you already have, and save some time, or free someone
> else up to do another job.
>
> THIS sort of thing, helping parties start and then helping them to work
> at their best, is what I envisaged as the whole reason for PPI. Not to
> set rules and policies or control who says and does what. We've been
> talking about who votes, and at the same time we say the PPI has no
> power to compel, so whats the votes for? As far as conferences go, we've
> had 5 over 3 years and almost everything agreed on at them has yet to
> happen. So let's take them back to their original purpose, as a social
> event, where we can put faces to (screen)names, and we can talk and
> learn from each other and from outside, invited speakers. Even the
> simple suggestion I made almost 18 months ago, that parties send PPI a
> copy of their press releases (or at last their important ones, including
> to the list) has gone mostly ignored in favour of vastly increasing
> bureaucracy.
>
> PPI isn't the UN and it's not the EP. Right now, we have a load of
> statutes, but it's all legal mumblings, it gives structure to an
> organisation that has no teeth, no ability for anything it decides to
> actually be carried out. The only purpose it has ever actually worked,
> has been as a central contact for new parties, and that can be better
> handled by a regional council, say a member per continent, and a
> president of same (giving 6 members and a tiebreaker voting president,
> since Antarctica won't have a party)
>
> In short, the job of PPI is, and always has been, supporting the
> formation of new parties, and supporting existing ones as and when
> needed, through increasing and facilitating communication. We're
> straying from that. I just had a quick look back through some of the
> coreteam meetings, and the vast majority of the topics over the last few
> months, have been about the conference, the statutes, and the bank
> account. I doubt there's been more than half a dozen issues over the
> last 4 months not related to the conference/establishment of PPI. Were
> Douglas Adams still alive, this could be the basis for "Bureaucracy 2"
> (Bureaucracy was a game he co-wrote in 87 about the difficulties with
> changing your address at a bank). Hmm, I guess not so short after all.
>
> Perhaps a metaphor would be best. To build a house, you need builders,
> they're essential for the house to be constructed. It requires plans,
> and organisation to build it, and hard work from the builders. We're at
> a situation now, though, where the builders are in a permanent state of
> work, even though the house is built, and they're not needed. Once it's
> biult, it needs a minimum of maintaince, the scaffolding can come down
> and be removed, and it needs only minor work done occasionally. We don't
> need the rules, we don't really need 'the board' as there is now nothing
> for them to do, since the original purpose was abandoned at some point,
> for the purpose of justifying its own existence. What does it do now,
> and more importantly, how do we get back on track?
>
> Andrew
>
>
>
>>
>> On Fri, Apr 23, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Nicolas Sahlqvist <nicco77 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>> I agree, PPI is not intended to be a party, rather a forum for parties,
>>> thereby the name "Pirate Parties International".
>>>
>>> - Nicolas
>>>   PPI
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 22, 2010 at 11:07 PM, Justus Ršoemeth <squig at dfpx.de> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> As I wrote before, I don't think PPI should be 'used' for this, but we
>>>> should found a new european party for that.
>>>>
>>>> PPI has a global scope, and in the short and mid-run should be a global
>>>> forum for all the pirate parties to raise their voice, a forum where
>>>> pirate
>>>> parties can meet and a place hwre people who want to start a pirate
>>>> party in
>>>> a country where there is none could go to to get know-how and helping
>>>> hands,
>>>> as well as start-up infrastructure (forum, maybe a wiki too?).
>>>> If PPI would become the European party of the pirate movement all that
>>>> would be in jeopardy.
>>>>
>>>> On 22.04.10 22:46, Gregory Engels wrote:
>>>>
>>>> On 22.04.2010, at 20:59, Partidul Piratilor wrote:
>>>>
>>>> . Talking about a European PPI like a political party and make
>>>> comparisons
>>>> with other European examples will be out of the question for a simple
>>>> reason: there is no Europe wide political party. Even in European
>>>> Parliament
>>>> they have groups wich unite parties by similarities, and the groups do
>>>> not
>>>> decide what individual parties do.
>>>>
>>>> There are political parties on the european level.
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_political_party
>>>> They get funding from the european parliament, even
>>>> if they are not yet in the EP. thefunding has to stay on
>>>> the european level and cannot be used to finance
>>>> national member parties.
>>>>
>>>> it must have in at least one quarter of the Member States, one or both
>>>> of
>>>> the following:
>>>>
>>>> either it must have received at least 3% of the votes cast in each of
>>>> those Member States at the most recent European Parliament elections.
>>>> or it must already be represented by Members, whether Members of the
>>>> European Parliament for those states, or Members of the national
>>>> Parliaments
>>>> of those states, or Members of the regional Parliaments of those states,
>>>> or
>>>> Members of the regional Assemblies of those states.
>>>>
>>>> PPI could change some of its statutes and apply for such a status when
>>>> we
>>>> have met these criteria, but this is not yet to decide. We should be
>>>> represented in parliaments in at least 7 european countries, and i don't
>>>> see
>>>> it happen for at least 2 or 3 year at the very optimistic (unrealistic)
>>>> forecast.
>>>> Gregory Engels
>>>> International Coordinator
>>>> Pirate Party of Germany
>>>> mobile: +49 172 853 44 91
>>>> skype:gregory.engels
>>>> jabber:dichter at jabber.piratenpartei.de
>>>>
>>>> ____________________________________________________
>>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ____________________________________________________
>>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ____________________________________________________
>>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>>
>>>
>> ____________________________________________________
>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
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> ____________________________________________________
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>

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