[pp.int.general] Italian Pirate Party - Scandal

[Andrew Norton]

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On 9/25/2012 11:10 AM, MRE wrote:
> Dear Antonio,
> 
> What you said in your last email I already knew was your opinion, I
> wasn't asking you to repeat that, I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough.
> 
> I was asking your opinion on another question: Do you think that the
> PPI should be able to decide who is and who is not a member of PP-IT?

The problem is often one of pride, and involvement. People have a
problem dealing with issues in a fair and coherent manner when they have
a personal stake in it. It's why the phrase 'conflict of interest'
exists, and why we have a judiciary.

The point of the CoA existing, was to provide a neutral, uninvovled 3rd
party who could take these disputes, which may include many, or all of
the officers of a party, and give them a forum to express the facts of a
case, and get an outside, unbiased view based on the facts.

It's mediation/arbitration, plain and simple.

This is why all parties involved MUST agree to use it, because they have
no power to IMPOSE, but can act if all sides agree to let them mediate.

So right now, we have to really reform the CoA, and make sure it is run
in the way we would like other orgs run, then it can start doing its job
properly. A major problem, right now, is that the CoA has been comprised
of a lot of the same faces that are the regular 'representatives'. They
likely already know one or more of the parties to an incident, and so we
have an issue of CoI.

Perhaps that was the niggling feeling I got when the CoA was being
elected (of course, it could have been the onset of hypothermia, as a 1
hour election at 3am - meaning i had to sit outside to avoid waking
people - turned into 8 hours of mess) that it was a populist vote (there
were 6 candidates for 7 slots, and instead it was reduced to 5) as
people voted for their 'friends'. I do wonder if I should have run
(thereby making 7 candidates for 7 spots), and where we would all be now
in that case.

Andrew

> 
> Best regards,
> 
>                Muriel
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 2012/9/25 Antonio Garcia <ningunotro at hotmail.com>:
>> That is an easy one, Muriel. I'm surprised you dare ask.
>>
>> Because the PPI GA did not have the right, per its own Statutes, to grant
>> Pirates de Catalunya full member status the way it was done after Kenneth
>> blackmailed it threatening to derail the GA with all the international press
>> present only months before two important elections in Germany.
>>
>> There you have it, spelled out in full.
>>
>> They're funny selective and have a nice blind spot for their own behaviour,
>> those nice catalans.
>>
>> Best Pirate wishes.
>>
>>
>> Antonio.
>>
>>> From: muriel at pirata.cat
>>> Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2012 15:30:06 +0200
>>
>>> To: pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>>> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Italian Pirate Party - Scandal
>>>
>>> Dear Antonio,
>>>
>>> I don't understand why you find it so funny that I think the PPI has
>>> the right to decide upon its members but it does not have the right to
>>> decide upon PP-IT members (unless all the involved parties agree on
>>> PPI arbitration to solve something that is an internal problem). Do
>>> you think that the PPI should be able to decide who is and who is not
>>> a member of PP-IT?
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Muriel
>>
>> ____________________________________________________
>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>>
> ____________________________________________________
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
> 


- -- 
Andrew Norton
http://ktetch.co.uk
Tel: +1(352)6-KTETCH [+1-352-658-3824]
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