[pp.int.general] Basic income - how does that fit into the pirate ideology?

Zbigniew Łukasiak zzbbyy at gmail.com
Fri Jul 12 22:31:43 CEST 2013

On Fri, Jul 12, 2013 at 10:15 PM,  <illunatic at greenpirate.org> wrote:
> Instead of imposing it as a platform, a given party should get an idea of
> whether people in their country support basic income. Get the public
> discussion going before coming to a conclusion one way or the other. If that
> is what your people want, especially party members and supporters, then that
> is a good time for party leaders to talk about making it a platform.
> Consider the the following:
> - Is there adequate awareness and open discussion of this issue in your
> country?
> - Do current members of your party support this?
> - Do enough citizens in your nation support this position that it would
> increase overall support for your party?
> If the answer is none/not much/not many, it may not be a good time to firmly
> embrace this as a platform. The exception to this, of course, is if you run
> a very authoritarian party in which you are prepared to dictate and proceed
> with any given platform, regardless of what your peers think.

Oh - discussion is fine with me and I fully support the democratic
process you describe - but at some point we need to come out with a
platform common to all the pirate parties.  So far what we have on
that platform is just the name - but that is not enough to have any
coherent movement.  I am testing where there can be some kind of
consensus at least between the people on this list.  That consensus
does not need to be perfect in everything - but at least most of us
need to agree on every point and no one should disagree on more than a
couple of points.  And those points also need to be meaningful as a
political program - that is they need to be something that there are
people that disagree with them - they need to be divisible - otherwise
we should not call ourselves the pirate parties but maybe the human
parties or something.


> Quoting Zbigniew ?ukasiak <zzbbyy at gmail.com>:
>> Basic income is often mentioned as point of the pirates program.  Do
>> you think it is a universal thing across all pirate parties - or is it
>> just the German pirates that stand strongly behind it?
>> Do you think it is leftist?
>> Personally I support Basic Income.  It might be viewed as slightly
>> leftist - but if it is introduced together with a linear taxation
>> scale and getting rid of unemployment benefits - then it is not
>> leftist at all.  For me the most important aspect of this whole
>> package is that it makes governance simpler.  Taxation is decoupled
>> and can be payed independently for all income sources and the state is
>> not forced to do things that depend too much on personal circumstances
>> (like checking if the person is really unemployed and if he really
>> tries to find a job etc) - state is not good in these - people quickly
>> learn how to fool it and that is demoralizing.  But state is good for
>> universal services - like paying everyone the same amount.  So let the
>> state do what it is good at and let other, smaller organizations do
>> other things.
>> There are of course many other benefits as well - but this is what
>> moves me personally.
>> --
>> Zbigniew Lukasiak
>> http://brudnopis.blogspot.com/
>> http://perlalchemy.blogspot.com/
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Zbigniew Lukasiak

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