[pp.int.general] Moderated PPI discussion list

[Zbigniew Łukasiak]

On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 8:33 AM, Frédéric JOUVIN
<frederic.jouvin at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Antonio.
>
> I am here to bring you my full support, from my PP FR personnal disaster
> experience.
>
> I loved particularily loved one of your declarations :
>
> "PPI is becoming another damn USA governmentlike corporate entity, counting
> on all the children to unwittingly make up the big controlled mass."
>
> I've read some of your emails, and mostly agree with all what you are
> stating.
>
> Regarding the most important problems I saw in France at PP FR is that they
> are good at :
>
> - Spending all their energy and time in doing things that will not change
> the future at all, not even help spreading our voice and values. Indeed,
> every time somebody wants to build a project that could have an impact on
> something, this guy is charged by a clearly "nasayer" identified group that
> will pull it out of the party.
>
> - Too much infiltrations from some governement agencies into the party
> itself, so much that real cypherpunks and hacktivists are clearly adviced
> not to go to the PP FR if they do not want to get into serious troubles.
>
> - They clearly did all what they could to in the end not support bradley
> manning, assange, etc. They hardly fake their support to the cypherpunk
> values and goals. They never want to really support any true hacktivists
> event. They don't like the Anon familly and so on. I had to fight like
> nobody could believe about bradley manning.
>
> - They don't want to talk about philosophy and values of the cypherpunks.
>
> To me, they defend the current system and statut quo, and they don't give a
> fuck about cypherpunks and crypto-anarchists values and revolution.
>
> And yes, to me, it's leading to nowhere.
> They are here just to make people loose their time.
>
> Of course, they are some real and honnest pirates in this party, but it's
> like they have lost influence, and power, and they can't spread the good
> words and love in this party any longer.

I can understand your frustration - but unfortunately I don't know too
much about the French pirates - so I cannot discuss that part of your
email.

As to your support for Antonio Garcia - does that mean that you
believe that one person should have the right to dominate this mailing
list by an avalanche of emails?  I don't.  Personally I also find
these emails frequently void of any new content and filled with the
same expressions of his frustration.  This boring and also frustrating
to read this over and over again, but I would not complain on that,
because it is hard to draw a line here and decide who is boring and
repeating.  What is more objective and easier to judge is the sheer
amount of text he sends to this list - this is like shouting in a
meeting - effectively making other voices inaudible and this is not
democratic.  I have the feeling he does not want to take us as his
peers - but rather beat us into submission by his writing.  I don't
find this kind of action acceptable.

Cheers,
Zbigniew


>
> ----------------------------------
> Le 16 juin 2013 à 20:43, Antonio Garcia <ningunotro at hotmail.com> a écrit :
>
> Let me guess? You ain't telling me :) .
>
> Please, please very much... do evolve.
>
>
> Antonio.
>
> ________________________________
> Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 20:18:16 +0200
> From: francisco.george at gmail.com
> To: pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> Subject: Re: [pp.int.general] Moderated PPI discussion list
>
> Dear Antonio,
> As spaniards say, you are just being "CANSINO". That is why you are OUT of
> our general talk list(but remain in others). And don't forsee your return as
> you haven't change. Just too easy to use always the KinderGarten argument
> when you don't even give the slightest chance to anyone to evolve.
> Best regards
> Francisco George
> Member of the PP-ES Board
>
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--
Zbigniew Lukasiak
http://brudnopis.blogspot.com/
http://perlalchemy.blogspot.com/