[pp.int.general] Invitation to the PPI General Assembly 2011

Thu Jan 20 00:56:38 CET 2011

I got this from him EVERYDAY in USPP.  Thus why I and all the State Party
heads ran away to their states rather than deal with USPP.

ANYWAY, I can't make it to that because I'm well....poor :-/

But thanks for the invite and I'll send it to the other state officers ;-)

Jay Emerson
Administrative Officer
Pirate Party of New York
On Jan 19, 2011 6:24 PM, "Andrew Norton" <ktetch at gmail.com> wrote:
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> On 1/19/2011 3:06 PM, Gregory Engels wrote:
>
> ... a lot of stuff that doesn't match with facts.
>
>> On 19.01.2011, at 20:19, Andrew Norton wrote:
>>
>>> and why, for the first time, a location was not actively sought out and
>>> organised (as was done in the past, especially as now we have a board
>>> which is supposed to do that),
>>
>> What gives you an impression, that the board is not organizing the
>> conference? I also like to add, that comparing the past, as international
>> conferences were held with a dozen or so participants with the now
>> planned event, that aims for c.a. 150 participants, will at best will
give
>> a slightly skewed impression.
>
> I know they were before your time, but the early ones had more than 'a
> dozen or so participants'. This event, do you have "150 participants"
> confirmed, or is that just your hope? Many of the others have said a
> similar kind of 'hope', even the first one.
>
> How do I know you're not organizing it? Because you yourself said so,
> when you sent out a request for bids for it. If you're organising it,
> YOU are organising it, you're not asking anyone else to give you
> suggestions for organising it.
>
> Let's put it another way. Either you organised it, and spat in the face
> of tradition (and of all the non-EU parties) by deciding it would be in
> Germany (your home country, and also rather close to Jay's home
> location, meaning 3-4 hours drive for both offers)
> OR, You did not organise it, and it was put up for an open submission
> process (as http://int.piratenpartei.de/Conference-offers would
> indicate) then you have just flat-out LIED.
>
>>
>>> and why the established guidelines of
>>> having it in a different country each time was ignored.
>>
>> There were no other offers from any other country than Germany. As
>> you know, you actively have lobbied in the US-PP against submitting
>> an offer to host the conference in New-York.
>
> Again, a flat out lie.
> Sorry, but the only person I actively said 'the US is a bad idea' and
> "lobbied" as you put it to, was yourself, in private. To which your
> response was, I believe something along the lines of "I don't care about
> the border thing myself, I go to the US maybe twice a year anyway, and
> it doesn't bother me" (I'll grep my logs for the actual quote if you
> wish) but that was in response to the statement from me, to you, that
> many pirate members are unwilling to submit to the extremely intrusive
> border procedures of the US that the Pirate Parties actively are
> against. It's a sickening example of what we brits call "I'm all right,
> Jack" (where because it's not an issue for you, you dismiss it as an
> issue for anyone else), which is just plain not acceptable in someone
> who is a leader of an international body, ESPECIALLY when we're dealing
> with what is a core issue of that body.
>
> As to the US proposal itself. At the time it was proposed to the US
> party that we put in an offer (November 3rd 2010) I was not present (in
> fact, I had a 103F/39.3C fever, and a very swollen face, leaving me
> unable to eat for a week). It was approved
> (http://memwiki.pirate-party.us/2010-11-03) and sent to the New York
> (the city YOU were lobbying for, despite it's high costs - it is after
> all one of the most expensive places in the world) state party to act on
> (in the form of prolific PPI poster, Jay Emerson). When, a day before
> the deadline, another national party officer asked for records and/or
> details about the offer, he was told there was none, and that 'more
> time' would be requested (http://memwiki.pirate-party.us/2010-11-30
> search for 'convention')
>
>>
>> We have sent out three reminders on submitting offers, and have
>> actively asked many parties, but with no success.
>>
>
> So, you are confirming the earlier question that were not doing the
> initial organisation, but were asking others to submit. So, when you
> said "What gives you an impression, that the board is not organizing the
> conference?" my answer is "every one of your 3 reminders, the PPI wiki,
> and the initial request for offers" gave me that impression.
>
> Here's another reason why I know you didn't organise them. PPI minutes
> from December 30th
> "Gregory comment: I really see both offerors as very capable to conduct
> our conference and to fulfill all of our requirements - the Osnabrück
> offers would perhaps mean more flexibility and therefore i would have
> preferred it, if I could vote fully free. But to avoid a deadlock"
>
> So you even admit that you weren't even holding out for the best
> conference, you were just gong for what was EASIEST.
>
>>> Also, is the new board going to be elected before the new statutes, or
>>> vice versa (it makes a BIG difference, when you're elected, and you
>>> don't even know the details of the job and powers you've been elected
>>> to do)
>>
>> Dear Andrew, as this obviously has sliped your attention, as you was
>> reading
>> the Invitation, it had a preliminary agenda attached to it. If you go and
>> reread it, your question should be answered.
>
> I missed it, partly because the email was poorly laid out, and then,
> once I HAD found it, it took more time to understand which 'voting
> block' was which. Mostly though, I was a little upset to finish it,
> after reading all the double-talk, and misdirection and outright lies in
> the main body of the email (like the "General Assembly - highest body of
> the PPI", which anyone who actually reads the statutes and has gone
> through your meeting logs knows is not true)
>
> So please, Gregory, tell us more why we should support this sham of an
> organisation, which seems to be mostly run for the benefit of one or two
> people (coincidentally enough, the same people that wrote its statutes)
> and which has done less (with more, no less) in the past year, than the
> organisation has done at any time prior to your stewardship.
>
> Frankly, your actions and activities over the past 9 months have
> *SICKENED* me. You are spineless, duplicitous, and self-absorbed. We
> also won't mention (too much) how, despite supposedly being separate
> from any national party, you've been actively working for the German
> party. Oh go on then, since I ended up mentioning it. The fact that you,
> despite supposedly not considering yourself part of any national party
> (according tot he statutes YOU HELPED WRITE), boast on your national
> party wiki page (http://wiki.piratenpartei.de/Benutzer:Dichter), that
> you are their (PPDE's) international representative, and also an
> elections officer and candidate in an election taking place at roughly
> the same time as this conference. You can hardly be said to be working
> in PPI's best interests, when at the same time you're working
> specifically for a national party in order to get elected (and already
> taken part in a local election not 3 months ago), AND when you represent
> that same party in the General Assembly. It showcases one of two things,
> a disgusting lack of integrity, or a unforgivable lack of thought to not
> recognise such a conflict of interests. Either one, to be honest,
> requires you resign from your PPI post forthwith, if you do have any
> integrity and wish to preserve any prospect of PPI being viewed as more
> than just a waste of time, money and effort, and a mouth piece for
> specific national parties.
>
> The work of the board in general has also been useless. There are issues
> - - the lack of transparency (here's an idea, instead of an audio
> recording, publish a transcript as well, that way it doesn't
> discriminate against those that can't listen to the files - either for
> hardware reasons, or medical ones - or who can't actually make out what
> you are saying, AND makes things actually searchable.); with bank
> accounts; the nearly month-long lack of the PPI website, which was
> reported on Jan 4th as "Hard disk crash, Gregory is in contact. Backup
> is there, should be up soon." &now the 19th and still nothing; then
> there's been the financial repayment issues from the LAST conference.
>
> In fact, is there ANY topic, situation, or action in which the PPI, as
> it is now, has acted in a timely manner, showing integrity and
> transparency. The same kinds of integrity, and transparency the national
> parties PPI claims to represent were formed to demand from our
> respective governments. I've spent the past part of 90 minutes when
> writing these emails, and I've not found any yet. And perhaps if there
> was, People might still actually care about the PPI, maybe to the point
> where someone other than your own party would have put in a bid.
>
>>
>> sincerely yours,
>>
>> Gregory Engels
>> Co-Chairman
>> Pirate Parties International
> PiratenPartei representative to the PPI General Assembly
> Municipal elections officer and leading candidate in Offenbach for the
> local elections on 03/27/2011
>
>>
>> mobile: +49 172 853 44 91
>> skype:gregory.engels
>> jabber:dichter at jabber.piratenpartei.de<jabber%3Adichter at jabber.piratenpartei.de>
>> ____________________________________________________
>> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
>> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
>> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
>
>
> - --
> Andrew Norton
> http://ktetch.blogspot.com
> Tel: (352)6-KTETCH [352-658-3824]
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> ____________________________________________________
> Pirate Parties International - General Talk
> pp.international.general at lists.pirateweb.net
> http://lists.pirateweb.net/mailman/listinfo/pp.international.general
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